Running a Third Generation Family Business: An Interview With Sarah Baird Schaefer
Steve Stack:
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Dive into topics like architecture, industry trends, project plans, historical tools, tricks of the trade, and life lessons from more than six decades of experience in the hardwood lumber business.
The Next Generation of Family Ownership
Steve Stack:
Hello, everybody. Steve Stack here, back at Studio 3B. We’ve got a really neat little segment for you today on the American Hardwood Advisor. I have a special guest, a third-generation Baird, Miss Sarah Schaefer. Hello, Sarah.
Sarah Schaefer:
Hi. Thanks for having me.
Steve Stack:
Oh yeah, thanks for taking the time to come back and join us. You are a recently newer addition to 7060 Crory Road. You’ve been around your whole life but you had a little adventure before you wound up back here. So, welcome back home.
Sarah Schaefer:
Thank you. It’s good to be back.
Steve Stack:
I got to ask, you’ve been a busy young lady, went through high school, went off to school at the Ohio State University in Wooster, right?
Sarah Schaefer:
Mm-hmm.
From Agriculture Career Path to Manufacturing Company
Steve Stack:
What did you study at Wooster?
Sarah Schaefer:
I studied animal science at Ohio State Wooster.
Steve Stack:
You came out of Wooster and where’d you go from there?
Sarah Schaefer:
So from Wooster, I got a job with the State of Ohio as a meat inspector and I inspected local meat processing plants for about two years.
Steve Stack:
I didn’t realize it was two years. So you’ve got some miles behind you, did some traveling in the process of visiting the different facilities, probably met some friends.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh absolutely.
Steve Stack:
Made some new acquaintances, right? And with your background, that seemed fitting, right? You were born and raised on a farm around the animals. You were active the whole way through with the 4-H programs, the open shows, showing pigs, showing cattle, messed with the horses a little bit.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh yeah. Draft horses a little bit there.
Steve Stack:
So you were definitely involved in the agricultural side of things. That’s cool. At some point, you decided to come back to Crory Road and we’re glad you did. We’re really glad you did. You can tell the folks or I can introduce it, you have a beautiful baby girl who’s seven months old, I think somewhere around there. She persuaded you to come back to Crory Road.
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely, yeah.
Steve Stack:
It’s a little easier having a standard hours kind of job versus the facilities that you had to visit at all hours of day and night.
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely.
Steve Stack:
Good. Good. Good. You and your husband are still heavily involved in agriculture.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah. We have a crop farm in Greenford, Ohio. We also have some livestock and we do freezer beef.
Steve Stack:
So you’ve got the agricultural side covered. Through previous conversations you and I’ve had, you explained the difference to me. You say you grow crops, that’s your typical corn, soybean, etc. but you guys take it a step further and you guys produce food-grade crops, correct?
Sarah Schaefer:
Mm-hmm. Yeah. We dip a little bit into food-grade soybeans.
Steve Stack:
So what’s the difference?
Sarah Schaefer:
There are certain seeds, fertilizers, rules and regulations when it comes to food-grade beans. But the advantage for us raising them is that there’s a huge selling advantage. They sell at a much higher price than just your conventional beans would.
Steve Stack:
So, attention to detail in tracking the crops, the fertilizers, even the harvesting technique, the sorting, and so forth. So that transitions to how your attention to detail transitioned you right into the role that you’ve taken up here at the offices. Go ahead and tell the folks what you’re up to on your day-to-day here at the mill.
First Generation as Family Business Advisors
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah. So day-to-day, I handle all of the accounts receivable for our accounts. I also assist my Uncle Scott in payables. I do most of the bill entering and things here and there for him. If he’s off, I cover in his spot. So that’s what I’ve been doing here. A lot of my previous experiences have really helped me as far as record keeping and working with the public goes. A lot of it may not directly apply but there were a lot of indirect skills that I learned in those years that I’ve brought back.
Steve Stack:
Those are all very important but I think we’re missing one of the most important things. Sometimes being in the accounts receivable department might not be the most enviable task, but you bring a personality that allows you to smooth things over a little bit when need be. Or, and I’ve seen it, you can be pretty tough.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah. I grew up with four brothers. So I’ve learned throughout the years, and I’m pretty laid back for the most part (you have to be with four brothers or else you’d be pulling your hair out a lot), but I’ve also learned when it’s time to put your foot down and hold your line.
Steve Stack:
One thing that I respect about you is that you came in over the years, and you’ve heard some customer names and this and that. But if you run into a situation, you know there’s always a backstory. When you run into a situation, you’ve got yourself into the habit of coming and talking to me, Mr. Donatelli, Scotty, or your dad, Matt. Every situation that you encounter is unique and it has to be treated as such.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh absolutely. I guess I’ve been working here for around two years now, but that’s nothing. It’s like 30 years I think is the minimum now. So there’s certainly a lot.
Steve Stack:
What was that in reference to?
Sarah Schaefer:
There are a lot of people around here that have much more knowledge on contractors and previous situations that we’ve been in. So whenever I get in a situation I’m not sure how to navigate, I just use my resources along the way. And it’s worked out pretty well.
The Pros and Cons of Working in the Family Office
Steve Stack:
Yeah. It’s a big task and you’re doing a fantastic job of it. Like a lot of us, you’re going to build lifetime relationships with a lot of these people. You and I both know we’re nothing without them. We have to find a way to make a two-way street work and have that line of communication and go on to the next project, then the one after that. So again, nice job on that. We’ve touched on the task of the accounts receivable side. I think that’s the smaller challenge of your day-to-day. Right now, I know you’re situated in the same office as your father. How in the world does that work out throughout the course of the day?
Sarah Schaefer:
Well, I don’t think anybody here has their own office. So I don’t have many options. But no, I enjoy working next to my dad day-to-day. It’s really a privilege to just get to have his wisdom and knowledge sitting right there at the desk next to me and be a part of that because he’s worked hard here in his life. He has knowledge that is unmatched to me or by any of my siblings. So we definitely need his guidance along the way and it’s nice having him right there.
Steve Stack:
That’s important and I don’t have to remind you because you appreciate it every day. I had the same fortune of, up until the time I moved out of the house, I rode to work every day with my father and came here for years and years and years. Then we worked side by side here. You not only have your father, but you’ve also got your two brothers-
Sarah Schaefer:
Zach and Ben.
Steve Stack:
Okay. And then you have the matriarch.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yes. The one and the only.
Steve Stack:
Miss Margo. Grandma.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yes, my grandma.
Steve Stack:
We can’t overlook the fireball who heads up our human resources, your Aunt Lori, right?
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely.
Steve Stack:
You experience it, I’ve experienced it. We talk about it. A lot of people talk about it. It’s a family company. There are going to be problems.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh absolutely.
Steve Stack:
But at the end of the day, you’re all still family. People that have never experienced it, and we can never take it for granted, it’s a privilege working with your family.
Sarah Schaefer:
It is. I think that’s one of the things that I gained so much in my years working for the state and going to school and stuff is that I came back with a different appreciation that I don’t think I would’ve had coming out the gate right out of high school.
Steve Stack:
It’s a big world out there.
Sarah Schaefer:
It is. Yes. It’s very big.
Steve Stack:
You know what? In mentioning your Aunt Lori, she did the same thing.
Sarah Schaefer:
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Steve Stack:
Your brother Zach did the same thing. Benny went out and tried some different things. And when you come back to the family-owned business, you guys are held to the same regard as everybody else on this facility.
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely, yeah.
Steve Stack:
Right? And the street might be paved but it’s not always smooth.
Sarah Schaefer:
There are definitely some potholes along the way.
Balancing Work Life and Family Conflict
Steve Stack:
And that’s good. That’s good because that brings that appreciation. It brings appreciation to family. It brings appreciation to your non-family coworkers, brings appreciation to our customers and the business as a whole. That’s something that your grandfather, Richard, two of the things he appreciated most were his employees and his customers. So it’s great to see that being picked up by the third generation and keeping that in our approach to our customer base and moving forward and beyond. You’ve been around as long as I can remember from the time you were Gracie’s age at seven, right? Anything in particular, looking back, are there any memories that influenced you in saying, “I want to go back to Crory Road. I belong there.” Any memories you can share with us?
Sarah Schaefer:
So I think just like along the way, working with family members has its challenges. It’s not easy at all but I think it says a lot that along the way, everybody’s still here. We’re still one family. And when you take a step back and look at that, it’s pretty impressive because it’s not easy. But we all still come together at the end of the day. So for me, I look back at that and I see everybody still here, still together and that’s something I want to be a part of.
Steve Stack:
You hit on something that our audience may or may have not heard me say. Going back to when I won’t say how old I was back in the mid to late seventies, one thing stood out and stands out in my mind. Before the day was over, your Uncle Howard (Uncle Hatch), who is still here every day in his pickup truck, and your grandpa Richard would spend five to ten minutes circled around the bed of a pickup truck and having a conversation and communication with each other. Sometimes it was loud, other times it wasn’t, but everybody came back in the morning with the same goal.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah. That still very much happens today. It might not be out in the parking lot around the bed of a pickup truck. It might be in an office or in another situation, but it still very much happens today.
Steve Stack:
Oh yeah, and it’s important. You along with five other third-generation, or we’re up to six third-generations now, correct? We’ve talked with yourself, with your cousins, with your aunts and uncles, just like when they were coming into the business as second-generation. They were just like you guys with fire in your belly and “let’s take on the world” attitude. I’ve said it to you guys as I said it to your aunts and uncles and your father, they’re going to listen to whatever you guys say, right? Do they always act on it?
Sarah Schaefer:
No, there are definitely a lot of opinions and a lot of different ideas as to how to grow the business and how to evolve and make different things better. This is not a small business and I don’t understand everything that Ben does in a day. Well, we understand what everybody does and their job description but we don’t have the knowledge, the nitty-gritty detail. When someone comes to the table with an idea, it really takes all of us as all portions of the business to come together and decide whether or not it’s going to be something that works. And with that, I will say the second generation has done an amazing job at hearing us all along the way. Not everything is going to happen the way we think it’s going to happen or our ideas are not necessarily going to be put into play, but they will at least sit down and hear what we have to say and that’s probably the start to any struggle.
Steve Stack:
That’s so important. We have an ongoing project right now that I know you’re involved with. Your brother Benny is involved on the manufacturing side. Zach is involved on the engineering and manufacturing side. Tyler is on the IT side and with his two guys over in IT. It’s a new computer system that we want to launch to make us more efficient, service our customers better. But it takes all that input, and you guys are scattered across the board from front offices to manufacturing, everywhere in between. As a group, we bring that all to a meeting, maybe not all at once, different meetings, whatever, and we kick it around.
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely, yeah. I was just at a meeting this morning about a similar situation to the computer system, it takes all different opinions. There are so many portions to this business and we all have to work together to make it happen.
Business Owners and Family Leadership
Steve Stack:
Very much so. It’s exciting to see. I know my feelings on it, but I see you and your cousins (the third generation) coming in and taking active, major roles in our day-to-day. How do you see that growing?
Sarah Schaefer:
So I think we were all raised to come in and to take the bull by the horns and do everything we can to help. I definitely see that in our current situation. And I see throughout the years, everybody evolving in their roles and maybe moving to different roles. But in the end, I think we all will evolve into where we’re supposed to be. Right now I’m in accounts receivable, maybe I’ll end up there, maybe I won’t. And the same with some of my other cousins. Brandon and Dylan are helping in the trim shop. Dylan goes out on trucks and he does all kinds of different things. But I see us all evolving and I think time will tell where we’ll end up.
Steve Stack:
Very well said in that there have been certain things ingrained into you guys. Work ethic, the value of a customer, quality product, those are some things that can never change. We know that. We’ve lived it.
Sarah Schaefer:
Absolutely.
Steve Stack:
It’s important that we keep that while we move forward and-
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah, definitely want to keep our core values intact throughout.
Steve Stack:
We have a profile here in our region, especially the Mahoning Valley. We’re the big fish in a small pond. But as you know, our business is going national now and we’re a small fish in a much larger pond. But we have to be the best small fish out there. If we grow up to be a medium fish, that’s good too. But we still have to be the best at what we do. And we try that every day. Can you think back over your time here at the mill for any significant changes that you’ve seen? Implementation of new equipment, different procedures and policies that we put in place. Does anything jump out at you?
Sarah Schaefer:
So I think, like we previously talked about, the biggest change (and I feel one of the biggest improvements) for us will be this new computer system. We’re operating on a very outdated system. I think we can do a lot better in a lot of areas: in servicing our customers, making things easier for our salesmen, keeping tallies, orders and things. It’s just better all around. I think the computer system will definitely be a project that we’ll see through that it’s going to make a big change for this company.
Steve Stack:
I think so. The computer system has served us well. With growth and aging, it’s become antiquated. It’s time to refresh and update, and then leave room for expansion and building out that system down the road as we grow. And to your point of allowing us to better serve our customers, having information readily available and incorporating them into our new systems. So yeah, that’s a biggie.
Sarah Schaefer:
And I’ve seen my brother, Zach, come back. He was working for another company out in Kansas. Zach brings definitely a very intense personality to the table. And I think he’s going to be really an asset in moving some things around and really improving our production and different things, fixing it along the way to where I don’t know that some other people could do it. I tend to be a more laid-back person, as I already said, but he’s definitely an intense person. But I think we need that here.
Engrained “Roll Up Your Shirtsleeves” Attitude
Steve Stack:
I’ll rebut you a little bit on that, in that I know that you’re a “let’s get this done” kind of person also. Zach, in his previous stint away from home (again it’s a big world out there), he saw how manufacturing was accomplished at a different scale in a different industry. And you’re right, he definitely brings some assets back with him and that’s exciting, too. Speaking of exciting, not that the past two years or so haven’t been exciting for you when you were married and now with your new addition in Gracie, I know you’re talking about here in the near future hopefully starting construction of a new home. That’s going to be an exciting time.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh, absolutely. We’re so excited, too.
Steve Stack:
Just promise me one thing.
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh, dear.
Steve Stack:
I’m serious. I’ve stood in hundreds and thousands of homes and I’ve witnessed the arguments between contractors, between the homeowner, the husband, and the wife. Keep it fun. Do your homework and keep it fun. And it’s going to be, it will be fun. Know that there’s a whole staff here that you can bounce ideas off of and we’ll give you as much misdirection as we can give you. But, honestly, seriously, and I know your wheels are turning for months to a year down the road. What kind of products are you thinking about using in your new house?
Sarah Schaefer:
So my husband has kind of left the interior up to me. He says, “You know more about this than I do.” So I’m thankful for that. But I truly think putting hardwoods in your home is such an unmatched beauty. I don’t think any other material can capture the beauty that hardwoods do. So far we’ve discussed that we really like character-grade hickory. We also like the live sawn white oak that we recently have been implementing. I think this is live sawn behind us.
Steve Stack:
Yeah. We’ve got the character grade live sawn behind us here on the walls. Two great choices. I know my lifestyle, and not that it’s the right approach, but I’ve said it a thousand times, “I built this house to live in it not to be a showplace.”
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh yeah. That’s one of the arguments that I’ve had with my brother Zach and Ben. I was talking to them about different door and floor combinations that I was thinking of and they tell me, “Oh you need to do painted trim, you need to do painted trim.” I said, “My husband’s a farmer. There will be fingerprints all over that. No, we can’t do painting. No white trim, not for me.” Nothing wrong with white trim but for us, it’s not going to work.
Steve Stack:
Well, I don’t know. Over the years I’ve been in some beautiful old farmhouses and yeah they get dinged up and beat up a little bit, but I did see a lot of painted trim and some old craftsman farmhouses too.
Sarah Schaefer:
I don’t know.
Steve Stack:
When hubby is around, send him down to my office and we’ll have a little conversation.
Sarah Schaefer:
We’ll fingerprint stuff up.
Steve Stack:
But seriously, we’ll be here for you for all of the decision-making and the “we saw this here, we saw that there.” And we’ll be here for you through the course of your construction. Like I said, keep it fun. Keep it fun, keep it light. In regards to that, there’s been a lot of milestones here at Baird Brothers Fine Hardwoods from 1960 to today. 60 plus years of manufacturing fine quality hardwood products and a lot of memorable moments. I have dozens of memories. Do you have a memory that goes above the rest of them?
Sarah Schaefer:
Oh jeez. This is a tough question, let me think here. I definitely have enjoyed, and we haven’t been able to do it the past two years, but our Red, White and Trues. I love the community and seeing our customers face to face. I really have missed that the past couple of years and hopefully we can get back to it.
Steve Stack:
That’s a great answer. For folks in the audience that don’t know, typically during the last weekend in September we host an onsite carnival, overblown customer appreciation kind of day. From our 100 plus employees, I normally get about 70 volunteers to work that day. And it’s a full day. I enjoy seeing that because our employees enjoy it and they’re proud of what we do here and our work environment. And they are hosts, they’re ambassadors that day, so you’re right. The last couple of years we’ve had to do an offsite event, a virtual type of thing, but it won’t be long until we’re getting back to that. And yes, you are absolutely right. Every year for the past ten years it has been very memorable, very memorable. It’s been two or three years ago now with the interruption that we’ve experienced, the dedication of the flag post upfront with our relationship with the local VFWs. We always have our friends from Second Harvest Food Bank come and that’s a huge thing. A lot of good things happen that day and it’s easy to get fired up about it.
Sarah Schaefer:
It is, yeah, definitely.
Succession Planning for Future Generations
Steve Stack:
You thought that question was tough. This question’s tougher, yeah. You might pop an answer off and I’ll say, “Okay, that’s good with me!” Where do you see the third generation pushing this company forward in the future?
Sarah Schaefer:
So I definitely think the third generation brings a set of skills and experiences to the table that’s going to take us to the next level. And I can’t specifically say where that’s going to be yet. I don’t know. It’s still to be determined, on the horizon, but I definitely think that we have some very good assets coming up through. We will be fine in taking this to the next level with the guidance of Uncle Hatch, who’s first-generation, and all of the second generation along the way.
Steve Stack:
I’ve had an unfair advantage in having witnessed, not necessarily the transfer of power, but the transfer of responsibilities from the first generation to the second generation and now (said respectfully) to you “kids” as the third generation, right? Like the first generation did for the second generation, they turned over a healthy business. The second generation is working very hard to give you kids that same privilege. When it is bestowed upon you, pay attention to it, and it’ll be fine.
Sarah Schaefer:
Yeah. And I definitely think the second generation is going to be along for the ride for quite a while here and we have a lot to learn as the third generation.
Steve Stack:
And you nailed it. There’s a lot to learn and be accepting of learning because they have a lot of life lessons.
Sarah Schaefer:
They do.
Steve Stack:
So, Sarah, again, welcome back home.
Sarah Schaefer:
Thank you.
Steve Stack:
Great to have you. Folks, pay attention to us on our social platforms and here in the near future. Maybe we’ll go visit Sarah up in her office or something like that. But thank you for joining us today and we look forward to talking to you soon. Sarah, thank you.
Sarah Schaefer:
Thank you, Steve.
Steve Stack:
For all you folks listening, thanks for talking shop with Baird Brothers Fine Hardwoods. If you’ve enjoyed this episode and wanted to stay up-to-date with the American Hardwood Advisor series, give us a like and subscribe. For more tips, projects, and inspiration, check us out on Facebook, Instagram, or bairdbrothers.com. Until next time.
